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They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita.
We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil.
They would be a third world country without being in the union.

INDEPENDENCE could leave Scotland exactly the same in every way, experts warned last night.

Image
The Scottish economy will continue to be based on anti-poverty initiatives
As Scottish first minister Alex Salmond set out his timetable for an independence referendum, he was dealt a devastating blow after research showed separation from the UK would make absolutely no difference whatsoever.

Professor Henry Brubaker, of the Institute for Studies, said: "It will still be damp, windy and miles from everywhere.

"The Scottish people will continue to shop, drink, complain, work for the council, eat beige food and hate each other because of football, religion or some bastard hybrid of the two.

"They will watch the same television programmes as they did before, mainly because they have all seen Scottish television programmes and they're not making that mistake again.

"They will also retain their baffling sense of entitlement and the government will still interfere constantly in people's lives. The only thing that will change is that they'll be reduced to one set of shitwit politicians on which to pin the blame."

Brubaker added: "Meanwhile, the rest of the UK will also remain exactly the same, only more so."

The Scottish National Party condemned the research as racist stereotyping and then welcomed it for proving that independence would be completely risk-free.

The SNP wants to stage the referendum in autumn 2014 while the UK government insists it should take place next year paving the way for an argument so tedious that even a drunk Scotsman would find it difficult to sustain.

It has also emerged that Salmond ditched his initial plan for a referendum on the 700th anniversary of Scotland's victory over England at the Battle of Bannockburn after someone pointed out that it was pathetic.

See ya!
But please continue to send us the single malt whisky!

Next.....

The Welsh

and

Northern Ireland
(a hot potato )

If there's a referendum in 2014 they'll break away I reckon. Independence referendums always go that way. 2 years should give Salmon and his cronies enough time to whip up enough nationalist fervor to dupe the Scottish public into shooting themselves in the foot. Be a massive result if they do. 1 down 2 to go... We should challenge them to an all out naval punch up for the North Sea oil, winner takes all. That should escalate things nicely. Probably be surprised if there were Argie subs in the Firth of Clyde before the year's out.

The thing I diont get is independance from what exactly?

Subsidies?

I reckon they have the best of both worlds right now. Local Goverment, laws and piggy backing on the financial clout of the UK.

We need their claims to North Sea Oil. Its a fucked up thing to do economically because England already subsidises Scotland. I don't think the original reasons for the union (centralisation of political power, Scotland not being able to chose Monarchs) really apply today. Thing is Wales will want it too, not really a bad thing?

They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita.
We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil.
They would be a third world country without being in the union.

Im not sure they fully realise the financial implications of this. What happens when North sea resources dry up?

What currency will they use?

How will they survive not being in Europe or the UK? Take Amazon as an example with its massive warehouses and jobs it creates for UK and Europe. They will not want to have to export everything!

How will they pay for things like Emergency services, Health, Border control....ect!

How much will taxes have to increase to cover this?

If there's a referendum in 2014 they'll break away I reckon. Independence referendums always go that way. 2 years should give Salmon and his cronies enough time to whip up enough nationalist fervor to dupe the Scottish public into shooting themselves in the foot. Be a massive result if they do. 1 down 2 to go... We should challenge them to an all out naval punch up for the North Sea oil, winner takes all. That should escalate things nicely. Probably be Argie subs in the Firth of Clyde before the year's out.

They could quite easily set themselves up in the Luxembourg mould and offer tax breaks to promote business.

Author:	Barna Azul [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:37 am ]
Post subject:	Scotland?
Do you care? What do you think? (Reuters) - Scotland's devolved government said Tuesday it wanted to hold a referendum in late 2014 on breaking away from the rest of Britain, setting up a clash with London which wants the vote held as soon as possible to dispel uncertainty. The Scottish and British governments began playing a cat-and-mouse game over the future of the 300-year-old union between Scotland and England, with London saying the Scottish parliament had no legal authority to call a referendum on independence. Trying to seize the initiative from pro-independence Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond, London said it would allow Scotland to hold an independence referendum but only on terms acceptable to it. Salmond's Scottish National Party won a majority in Scottish elections last year, putting him in a strong position to push for a referendum on independence which is opposed by British Prime Minister David Cameron and other major British parties. Salmond, who has previously said a referendum should be held between 2014 and 2016, said Tuesday the Scottish cabinet wanted the vote held in the autumn of 2014. "This is the biggest decision in Scotland for 300 years. This has to be a referendum which is built in Scotland ... and then is determined by the good sense of the Scottish people," he told Sky News. Commentators say Salmond wants a later poll hoping support for independence in Scotland, currently running at around 38 percent, will build. Some reports say the party hopes to exploit two events in 2014, the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow and the 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn when the Scots vanquished an English army, to create momentum for a breakaway. "SOONER NOT LATER" Cameron says uncertainty over Scotland's future is damaging investment in the Scottish economy and wants the referendum "sooner rather than later." The British government said Tuesday the Scottish parliament had no power to call a referendum on independence and said it risked being struck down by the courts. It offered to grant the Scottish parliament the power to hold a referendum but said it wanted it held promptly. "It is essential that the referendum is legal, fair and decisive. As a government, we have been clear ... that we will not stand in the way of a referendum on independence. But neither will we stand on the sidelines and let uncertainty continue," Michael Moore, the British minister responsible for Scotland, told parliament. A British government source said London believed a referendum could be organised within 18 months. London wants only one question on the ballot paper, a yes or no on independence, ruling out a second question on granting more powers to the devolved Scottish government that voters wary of full independence might opt for. Salmond said Scots objected to the conditions that the British parliament was attempting to attach to the referendum. "The prime minister (Cameron) in the last 48 hours ... seems to be saying here's the power but incidentally we are going to start pulling the strings," he said. Cameron's Conservatives are weak in Scotland, with only 15 seats in the 129-member Scottish parliament. The British government gave people two months to give their views on the referendum and invited the Scottish government for talks to try to agree on a way forward. Scotland, which kept its own legal system after the 1707 union, has had a devolved government since 1999, with control over health, education and prisons in the nation of five million. Scotland has many of the trappings of an independent nation - its own flag, sports teams and a history of achievements in science and literature. The SNP argues that Scotland would prosper as a small country in its own right. Salmond told Reuters last year that Scotland would be entitled to the lion's share of North Sea oil revenues if it went its own way. He also wants Scotland to have its own forces and foreign policy, rejecting nuclear submarines based close to Glasgow.

Author:	Danny's Studs [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:38 am ]
Post subject:
See ya!

Author:	Winston_Smith [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:41 am ]
Post subject:
Cut them loose

Author:	Tresidentevil [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:00 am ]
Post subject:
We need their claims to North Sea Oil. Its a fucked up thing to do economically because England already subsidises Scotland. I don't think the original reasons for the union (centralisation of political power, Scotland not being able to chose Monarchs) really apply today. Thing is Wales will want it too, not really a bad thing?

Author:	Winston_Smith [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:04 am ]
Post subject:
They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita. We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil. They would be a third world country without being in the union.

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Author:	Barna Azul [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:11 am ]
Post subject:
Winston_Smith wrote: They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita. We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil. They would be a third world country without being in the union. Im not sure they fully realise the financial implications of this. What happens when North sea resources dry up? What currency will they use? How will they survive not being in Europe or the UK? Take Amazon as an example with its massive warehouses and jobs it creates for UK and Europe. They will not want to have to export everything! How will they pay for things like Emergency services, Health, Border control....ect! How much will taxes have to increase to cover this?

Author:	ESM [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:13 am ]
Post subject:
Winston_Smith wrote: They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita. We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil. They would be a third world country without being in the union. This. They cost 'us' more per person than the population of England. My understanding is that the vote would probably go against independence anyway. They know which side their bread's buttered.

Author:	gibbonicus_andronicus [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:18 am ]
Post subject:
yeah, currently at about 30% or so want independence. fucking let 'em. then bomb the fuckers and take the gas fields.

Author:	Barna Azul [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:47 am ]
Post subject:
INDEPENDENCE could leave Scotland exactly the same in every way, experts warned last night. Image The Scottish economy will continue to be based on anti-poverty initiatives As Scottish first minister Alex Salmond set out his timetable for an independence referendum, he was dealt a devastating blow after research showed separation from the UK would make absolutely no difference whatsoever. Professor Henry Brubaker, of the Institute for Studies, said: "It will still be damp, windy and miles from everywhere. "The Scottish people will continue to shop, drink, complain, work for the council, eat beige food and hate each other because of football, religion or some bastard hybrid of the two. "They will watch the same television programmes as they did before, mainly because they have all seen Scottish television programmes and they're not making that mistake again. "They will also retain their baffling sense of entitlement and the government will still interfere constantly in people's lives. The only thing that will change is that they'll be reduced to one set of shitwit politicians on which to pin the blame." Brubaker added: "Meanwhile, the rest of the UK will also remain exactly the same, only more so." The Scottish National Party condemned the research as racist stereotyping and then welcomed it for proving that independence would be completely risk-free. The SNP wants to stage the referendum in autumn 2014 while the UK government insists it should take place next year paving the way for an argument so tedious that even a drunk Scotsman would find it difficult to sustain. It has also emerged that Salmond ditched his initial plan for a referendum on the 700th anniversary of Scotland's victory over England at the Battle of Bannockburn after someone pointed out that it was pathetic.

Author:	South East Citizen [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:02 am ]
Post subject:
Barna Azul wrote: INDEPENDENCE could leave Scotland exactly the same in every way, experts warned last night. Image The Scottish economy will continue to be based on anti-poverty initiatives As Scottish first minister Alex Salmond set out his timetable for an independence referendum, he was dealt a devastating blow after research showed separation from the UK would make absolutely no difference whatsoever. Professor Henry Brubaker, of the Institute for Studies, said: "It will still be damp, windy and miles from everywhere. "The Scottish people will continue to shop, drink, complain, work for the council, eat beige food and hate each other because of football, religion or some bastard hybrid of the two. "They will watch the same television programmes as they did before, mainly because they have all seen Scottish television programmes and they're not making that mistake again. "They will also retain their baffling sense of entitlement and the government will still interfere constantly in people's lives. The only thing that will change is that they'll be reduced to one set of shitwit politicians on which to pin the blame." Brubaker added: "Meanwhile, the rest of the UK will also remain exactly the same, only more so." The Scottish National Party condemned the research as racist stereotyping and then welcomed it for proving that independence would be completely risk-free. The SNP wants to stage the referendum in autumn 2014 while the UK government insists it should take place next year paving the way for an argument so tedious that even a drunk Scotsman would find it difficult to sustain. It has also emerged that Salmond ditched his initial plan for a referendum on the 700th anniversary of Scotland's victory over England at the Battle of Bannockburn after someone pointed out that it was pathetic.

Author:	Frank Blue [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:25 am ]
Post subject:
See ya! But please continue to send us the single malt whisky! Next..... The Welsh and Northern Ireland (a hot potato )

Author:	Frank Blue [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:30 am ]
Post subject:
a comment on the BBC: "If Scotland has always wanted independence (in the eyes of the SNP), a vote now or in 3 years time will make no difference to the the outcome. Opinion polls suggest well over 70% of Scots do NOT want independence." I wonder what percentage of the English would vote for England being independent from Scotland? Where's ESM? He'll be for the Republic of Yorkshire.

Author:	Barna Azul [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:41 am ]
Post subject:
The thing I diont get is independance from what exactly? Subsidies? I reckon they have the best of both worlds right now. Local Goverment, laws and piggy backing on the financial clout of the UK.

Author:	Frank Blue [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:47 am ]
Post subject:
Barna Azul wrote: The thing I diont get is independance from what exactly? Subsidies? I reckon they have the best of both worlds right now. Local Goverment, laws and piggy backing on the financial clout of the UK. oh shit! here comes the New Scottish Army!!! Release the dogs!!!

Author:	kippax_in_my_blood [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:20 pm ]
Post subject:
set them free... tight moaning ginger twats....not to tar em all..ahh fuck it yes i am..

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Author:	DarloBlue [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:
Tresidentevil wrote: We need their claims to North Sea Oil. Its a fucked up thing to do economically because England already subsidises Scotland. I don't think the original reasons for the union (centralisation of political power, Scotland not being able to chose Monarchs) really apply today. Thing is Wales will want it too, not really a bad thing? Nah, historically England and Wales have always been fairly close and the appetite for independence is fairly minimal. Winston_Smith wrote: They are subsidised to the tune of £800 pa per capita. We can legitimately claim 30-50% of the north sea oil. They would be a third world country without being in the union. Not necessarily. They could quite easily set themselves up in the Luxembourg mould and offer tax breaks to promote business. That's what previously had seen a lot of gaming companies transferring offices to the UK (and actually a fair amount to Scotland). It also benefits from having some fairly reputable universities (St. Andrews) which benefits fields of industry where innovation is prioritised. A country with a small population such as Scotland would be able to operate in a wholly different style to how the UK currently performs. Barna Azul wrote: Im not sure they fully realise the financial implications of this. What happens when North sea resources dry up? What currency will they use? How will they survive not being in Europe or the UK? Take Amazon as an example with its massive warehouses and jobs it creates for UK and Europe. They will not want to have to export everything! How will they pay for things like Emergency services, Health, Border control....ect! How much will taxes have to increase to cover this? I'm pretty sure one of the first things an independent Scotland would do would be to apply for membership of the EU (if they weren't automatically granted it). Initially they'd use pound sterling only from the Bank of Scotland rather than the Bank of England. Kinda how they do already. It certainly isn't an issue that would require dealing with immediately. South East Citizen wrote: If there's a referendum in 2014 they'll break away I reckon. Independence referendums always go that way. 2 years should give Salmon and his cronies enough time to whip up enough nationalist fervor to dupe the Scottish public into shooting themselves in the foot. Be a massive result if they do. 1 down 2 to go... We should challenge them to an all out naval punch up for the North Sea oil, winner takes all. That should escalate things nicely. Probably be Argie subs in the Firth of Clyde before the year's out. Can't see it happening. It's an issue that the majority of Scottish people are already likely to know how they feel on the matter as it is a fairly prevalent issue in Scotland. It's not like the AV referendum (remember that?) where a lot of people never really had an opinion on the matter beforehand (or indeed during, or after). I'm struggling to foresee a 20% swing in two years considering its practically been hovering around the same mark for the last half of a century.

Author:	Winston_Smith [ Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:
DarloBlue wrote: They could quite easily set themselves up in the Luxembourg mould and offer tax breaks to promote business. But they will be run by socialists not tories. They will continue to be benefits crazy until the cash runs out. (See G.Brown)